In an idiotic war you need an equally idiotic populace who will put up with conscription or be fighting an opponent with a less idiotic populace than your own in order to win. In a fight as deranged as this one, with most of our military in Iraq and Osama in Pakistan where there’s not a single US troop on the ground…you need a populace that’s dizzy enough to stand for it in the first place, but that doesn’t solve the problem of where you’re going to get enough idiots to hop into the meat grinder voluntarily…especially now that football has started.
“The way you’d prevent Timmothy McVeigh from driving explosives into a parking garage has a lot to do with how you’d prevent someone from suicide bombing a shoping mall in Minnesotta. It’s not as easy as the press and our politicians make it out to be…for the terrorists I mean. To actually pull something off you’ve got to assume that you’re under surveilance from the moment the thought enters your mind, NEVER talk on the phone or use the internet to discuss plans, and try not to have brown skin and something more ridiculous than a cowboy hat on your head when you move into your neighborhood of whatever country you happen to be in…but also keep in mind that if you are caught by certain nations, your life is never going to be the same again…in fact, it just might be the most gruesome ordeal ever experienced by mankind, cold concrete cell-barking dogs-too much air conditioning-the Red Hot Chilli Peppers blasting into your dome nonstop for 37 straight hours.
Who’s going to volunteer if that’s in the playbook? Johnny Kicked a Hole in the Sky 700 times in a row, and yet they’re able to recruit and stir up enough shit to keep our military punch drunk on a consistent basis. What our enemies refer to as faith, I call stupidity…especially in light of their stated goals, world domination and such, as daft and out of touch as a crew of terrorists living in caves would have to be I suppose, makes me think of a little boy digging a hole and trully thinking that one of these days they’re actually going to reach the other side of the world, only these are grown men…makes you think about who we’re really fighting here. With Osama now having booked some sneaker commercials, he may have become untouchable, double stamped, no erasees. Free market’ll sort it out.
They’re winning right now for no reason other than their REAL goal, which is to get noticed and be feared by the people they hate. And on that score the votes have been in since 2002 when the wisdom of “don’t give them the satisfaction, go to work and carry on, don’t let fear become your weight to carry, or else they win in the end…” had to run into a mid-term election, and with Rove at the helm they went with what got them there. So now there are people howling at the moon, crazed up and ready to believe on both sides, though ours’, the one with the higher SAT scores, tends to fall short on only one aspect of the battle, recruiting.
In an idiotic war you need an equally idiotic populace who will put up with conscription or be fighting an opponent with a less idiotic populace than your own in order to win. In a fight as deranged as this one, with most of our military in Iraq and Osama in Pakistan where there’s not a single US troop on the ground…you need a populace that’s dizzy enough to stand for it in the first place, but that doesn’t solve the problem of where you’re going to get enough idiots to hop into the meat grinder voluntarily…especially now that football has started.
By 2008 someone might actually start quoting FDR constantly, and how he perceived fear during the great depression to be the worst thing that could happen to a people as great as ours. Those people were starving – – – What the fuck is our excuse?” (politicsAtTheDen)
Our leaders are lousy at governing and at fighting a war, but they’re brilliant at peddling the idea that they aren’t lousy. See, it’s all part of a big picture: ruin public education, denigrate science, end up with a more credulous populace. And guess what? It’s working. The number of people is ever increasing who think Saddam was behind 9/11, who think we found WMD there, and who think the world is 6000 years old. Coincidence? Doubt it.
They’ve made it ‘unpatriotic’ to criticize one’s own government. I’m a nazi sympathizer now according to them.
Jesus hates Badgirlsblog.com.
The Jesus I know only hates 2 things in this world, sin and the Democratic Party. I donate $$ to the 700 Club…so I’ve got that going for me…which is nice.
Yes, we know. You’re AT&T records are very telling.
Don’t worry all, we’ll really show the world how powerful we are when we invade Iran. My posse of intelligence analysts tell me that an Iranian conflict shouldn’t last more than 6 months at the most.
I wonder how much “Iraq Fatigue’ factors in with the populace. Like many say, if you don’t have a personal stake in it, it is just so many words. Might as well be talking about the boll weevil or cardigan sweaters.
It’s inhumane in my opinion for a country as rich as ours to put a stretched military through this. In the runup to WW2, FDR raised taxes on the wealthy, rationed supplies, had people growing victory gardens…
I’ve heard a number of times, Republicans when they’re asked what kind of sacrifice the country should make, respond with “we all sacrifice by paying taxes”…
Insulting, as the military pays taxes as well! If someone out there is feeling content, like they’ve done their part for the war effort because they pay taxes, they’re delusional. As is this rich-kid we’ve got running the country right now. It’s starting to blow up on them now though.
REAL MILITARY MEN in his own party aren’t allowing him to define standards for the treatment of detainees on his own terms. His mind can’t comprehend why it’d be a problem…
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060915/ap_on_go_co/bush_congress
Not to be an asshole or anything, but I’ve got no sympathy for any of our personnel in Iraq. They joined up knowing full well that war is hell. If they want to impress me then they can either speak up or shut up.
There are many (well, at least me) that are completely ashamed that we’ve contributed anything at all to this war. Yes, my taxes have gone towards it, and that’s a damn bit more than I would like. I do not feel any sense of compassion for warriors invading/occupying a foreign land, even if they carry the flag that flies over my head.
It may be that we have to bleed our military dry to justify an exit. What the hell do I know? Tired.
I don’t see them as warriors as much as kids who were looking for free college money. The advertising says one thing, and reality says another. And the outcry from the right over US troops being sent into BOSNIA by Clinton…remember that rabble?
I politicize the plight of our soldiers and marines because I was one of them and my brother was as well, but most importantly because we’ve hung them out to dry in Iraq. I’m not saying this because I want to score points or have something to stand on…I’m saying it because it’s TRUE.
And if this is going to be the thing from now on, then we should stop with the bullshit advertising already and come to grips with the fact that, NO, a kid graduating from high school in America is not guaranteed to know that war is hell, or that the recruiter is telling 5 lies for every truth.
It’s a scam.
captain – – – I’ve got to hit this up again because it’s been on my mind ever since I read it…
These kids didn’t choose the mission or the conditions in which to accomplish the mission…in fact, I’m not even sure the majority of them are even AWARE of their mission in the first place.
Washing ones’ hands of these people isn’t right just because the task they were deployed for has gone bad. Not a single enlisted soldier over there has any control over how this is playing out, nor do they have the ability to influence the civilians in charge of determining what happens next.
I don’t fault them for buying into the patriotic hoopla, believing what they see on the commercials, etc…because if we do that, start calling them mercinaries and whatnot, then when the day comes where there’s a just fight to wage somewhere, the corps won’t be what it was before all this happened.
They volunteered, and in that movie you hipped me to (that I watched twice), there was a part where a man pointed out that BECAUSE they volunteered, the civilian leadership and their political allies could then say, “hey, fuck you, you volunteered”…my dad and plenty of other right-wingers I looked up to growing up have that point of view, and THAT is what I believe is the greatest difference between now and FDR’s time, how as a country we’ve retained a sense of community ONLY when it comes to paying lip service to these things we consider uniquely “american”…the political situation this president has put us in does not allow for right-wingers to empathize with the same soldiers they thank every chance they get, supposedly. “fuck you man, you volunteered”.
Their sacrifice is only usefull when it’s time to talk tough or leverage their plight to achieve a political goal…when it comes to actually doing something FOR them…well, I already PAY taxes, and so, my sacrifice is covered…I gave at the office.
Then when we actually win a war one of these days, there will be parades and all kinds of nonsense to honor the 23 year old with no legs…put them into a war that cannot be won though, and suddenly the attitude towards them changes entirely. Because then there’s not only the reality of failure to stomach, but the amount of money, resourses and the loss of alliances with other foreign nations…that’s what we as Americans mourn most, and eventually it’s time to “move on”, and the war becomes the stuff of veteran AA and NA meetings, bullshit movies and misery.
It’s not those fighting the war you should be angry with, but the people who put them into that situation…the people who put you into the frame of mind where shame is the only truthfull emotion you can feel…I’m there as well, and I know what that feels like…
We cannot blame them. We can blame the flag, which is what I do. It’s not my voice being heard and agreed with prior to sending these guys into battle, but this is still my country. So for me, the flag is burning right now, and finding ways to put out the fire is difficult…
I’m losing it – – – – the kids are awake from their naps, sorry this didn’t get tied off nicely at the end…kind of scatterbrained lately, my grandfather is in the hospital, suffered a stroke, and my thoughts won’t line up in an orderly fashion as I’d like them to.
The problem with Timothy McVeigh was that he wasn’t a real terrorist. He didn’t die during the OK city bombing. So, he really didn’t die for something he believed in. He got caught; that was his story.
I just thought of an obscure pre, pre, PRE 9/11 movie: Arlington Road (1999), with Jeff Bridges and Tim Robbins. Totally spooked me. I didn’t see it coming. Just makes you think about the MEDIA and the so called ‘manufacturing consent.’
I tell you, you talk of quoting of FDR in 2008…think now of Gary Hart. This week on “The Daily Show,” Mr. Hart proclaimed himself as truly the last idealist in American Politics.
God, I’m in need of a great sex scandal. We need to get ben-gay out of the White House!!!!!!!!!
I saw that Gary Hart interview too. And I thought the same thing that Stewart said… “it’s lame that Democrats need a book telling them what their ideals should be.” The democrat party isn’t offering anything significantly different as far as I can tell. A bunch of whiners who can’t decide whether they’re for staying in Iraq or for getting out. History is history and we can bark all day about the major Bush administration screw-ups. But when it comes to Iraq it is a very simple question… “should I stay or should I go now?”
It will be quite a nice change when we elect Paris Hilton as the first woman president come 2024. This country is due for a very large nationwide party.
Al, we’ll have to just agree to disagree on this point. I’ve no sympathy for perfectly able adults, who are armed to the teeth and who committed themselves to a life of armed servitude to their country. My meager supply of sympathy goes to those who are nowhere near as fortunate as our armed forces personnel. I give you credit for standing by your mates, you were probably a great soldier.
And very sorry to hear about your granddad, hope he is getting good care.
“The Ground Truth” documetary is opening here in S.F. and I was wondering if any of you have seen it. The testimonials not only look at the injured GIs, but the uninjured GIs (the rest of us) in iraq and the possible guilt associated with it (Not being injured, while our buddies were; as well as the whole war criminality of this war…Aren’t we all war criminals for having seen so many arab women in their nighty nights?). Just looking for some feedback.
Paris Hilton will be a fine president once she gets the cock out of her mouth.
Heck, I’d vote for her with a cock in her mouth… and one in the ass.
Haaa!
More so than Hilliary!
Thanks CM – – – he opened his eyes today, a great turnaround from yesterday when the outlook was grim.
As for Dems and their message…it’s all domestic for the most part, and none of that gets headlines. It’s becoming common for people to come out and blast them for not being unified and clear about their goals…part of that I think is everyone wants to be in charge of directing all that, but there’s nothing to be in charge OF at the moment.
Just a bag of ideas at this point. The Republicans have it easier when it comes to that, as their agenda is basically decided based on who wrote the checks to finance their campaigns. There’s plenty of that on the Dem side as well, but we tend to be pro-environment, pro-worker – and those problems are more difficult to fix. Whereas in a lot of cases, this Congress simply had to kill regulation (air polution and mine safety come to mind) to get their debts paid.
The repatriation of billions they allowed to have happen a year or so ago was a big one…Intel or IBM brought back over $5 billion at a quarter of the tax rate…I watched the debate and Republicans were talking about how allowing these corporations to bring money back in without having to pay tax on it would CREATE JOBS…always their answer to anything concerning tax cuts. Now they’re laying off 10,000…